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Post by frankm on Nov 1, 2011 21:32:18 GMT
Thank you does not seem quite enough for all the wonderful information added since yesterday. I have learnt so much in the last couple of days. It looks as though I will be able to add a couple of generations to my family tree.
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Post by frankm on Nov 1, 2011 22:39:44 GMT
I think the link from annedw has solved another puzzle for me welshmormonhistory.org/index.php?/resources/view/4110 "On 15 July 1840 Dan's sister Elizabeth (born 1813) married William Willco-ck in the Marchwiel Parish Church (located on the outskirts of Wrexham), and on the same day and in the same location in what was apparently a double wedding his sister Sarah (born 1815) married Richard Arnold. Dan's father died at Wrexham on 6 February 1847 and his mother (Ruth Roberts Jones) died at Marchwiel on 20 December 1855. " Perhaps Sarah and Richard Arnold died while their daughter Ann was very young and this is why she appears at Plas Noble in the various census.
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Post by annedw on Nov 2, 2011 18:38:35 GMT
It seems John who left the will liked the young girls, I am almost certain I`m right with this, but only the marriage certificate from 1844 will prove it by giving ages and fathers names. Anyway- here goes. ;D ;D 1841 York St, Wrexham John Willco-ck 77 Ind, b.In county Dorothy Willco-ck 73 b.In county Elizabeth Williams Serv. Dorothy Wilco-ck death reg Wrexham Sep 1/4 1842. John Willco-ck death reg Wrexham, Dec 1/4 1850. In his will John states his wife is Elizabeth and this could be a marriage. 1844 Bangor Civil John Willco-ck / Elizabeth Morris. Wrexham Advertiser Death 27 November 1850 Mr Wilco-ck , York Street in his 88th year of his age In 1851 Elizabeth Wilco-ck is a widow living on York Street, she is an annuitant and is 24 born Wrexham . There is a Francis Wilco-ck 76 unmarried aunt living with her, born Longford Shropshire. Wrexham Advertiser Dec 1st 1851 On the 18th ult at Penybryn Chapel the Rev Aaron Francis to Mrs Willco-ck , relict of the late Mr Willco-ck. In 1851 Aaron Francis aged 35 is living on Stryt Draw ( Chapel St) he is a widower and the Minister of Penybryn Chapel. Seems to have been born possibly Llanrhaidr Children Allen F 9 , Maurice H 7, Ann E 6, his first wife in 1841 was Mary. By 1861 he is living in Rhyl with his second wife Elizabeth who is 40 and born Wrexham. They have two more children. 1871 she is 49, 1881 is 59 so all this seems to add up that she was born about 1821/22 and was only about 22 when she married John, he was at least 80.
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Post by frankm on Nov 2, 2011 19:58:16 GMT
Can't really find the right comment for this :-) so I 'll just say thanks for the info.
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Post by annedw on Nov 2, 2011 21:16:51 GMT
This is from Palmers History of the Older Nonconformity of Wrexham. There is a link somewhere in a previous post. There are a few mistakes in dates etc, but this is a very good book.
It seems to me that the Willco-cks moved between the Church and the Chapel, my own family the Wilcoxons were some of the founders of the Penybryn Chapel about 1783 and they flitted back and forth. " Mr. Wilco-ck lived in his own house on the east side of York Street, next below " The Hop Pole " (now " The Black Horse "). He had been a flaxdresser, and was brother to Mr. Thomas Wilco-ck, of PIas Noble, in the parish of Marchwiel. He married his second wife (who afterwards married the Rev. Aaron Francis) when he was more than 80 years of age. Died October 26, 1850, aged 88, and was buried in the churchyard.
Mr. Aaron Francis came from Ruthin, where he had been minister of the Welsh Congregational Chapel: married the widow of Mr. John Wilc=ock, of Wrexham and became afterwards the minister of the English Congregational Church at Rhyl, where he died Dec. 12, 1882, aged 70".
MODIFIED. John Willc-ock was a trustee of Penybryn Chapel. This book is now on Ancestry. A History of the Older Nonconformity of Wrexham and its Neighbourhood. History of the Pen-y-bryn Congregation
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Post by annedw on Nov 2, 2011 21:25:55 GMT
One of the executors named in the will was Robert Thornley, a little about him. Robert Thornley hat manufacturer Wrexham. 1851 Street Draw. Robert Thornley is 45 and employing 15 males and 7 females, he was born Wrexham, his wife Sarah 47 was born Oswestry, . Robert is still alive in 1891 aged 85, living on his own means in Birkenhead. He was there in 1861 as an estate agent, 1871, income from houses, so did well for himself.
A N Palmers Older Nonconformity of Wrexham "Mr. A. W. Thornley was a well-to-do hatter, who occupied three quaint old gabled shops next the Town Hall on the site of Nos. 1 and 2, Hope Street. His first wife died in 1826, and he subsequently (May 17, 1833) married Miss Mary Ann Levingstone, sister of Mr. Moses Levingstone When the old Brookside Tannery, formerly the property of Mr. Edward Evans was offered for sale, Mr. Thornley bought it, and so gave his name to what is now called "Thornley Square," while "Mary Ann Square" commemorates the name of his wife. A large portion of the land belonging to the tannery was presented by Mr. Thornley as a site for the British Schools, erected in 1844, to the building fund of which his wife contributed £100. He died, March 17, 1854, aged nearly 84, and was buried in the Dissenters' Graveyard. He was succeeded in his business by his son, Mr. Robert Thornley, who ultimately sold it to the late Mr, Edward Jones and now lives in Birkenhead.
Another executor Michael and Sarah Gummow, Wrexham Fechan" (admitted August 30, 1839), Salem Chapel, Leeds, and afterwards removed to Leamington. Mr.Michael Gummow was a builder, the grandfather of the present Messrs. W.H. and M. J. Gummow, of Wrexham : died May 21, 1876, aged 74, and was buried in the Dissenters' Graveyard.
All Non Conformist.
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Post by annedw on Nov 3, 2011 8:34:55 GMT
I can look at Wrexham PR`s and see if we can sort the Willco-cks out, probably the children of Thomas and Ann are either there or Marchwiel.
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Post by frankm on Nov 3, 2011 11:23:03 GMT
Thanks annedw, I am working my way through the info and reconstructing the family tree with all I have been given. So far there looks to be another fairly complete generation added in less than a week. As the official records didn't start until 1837 and I am now back to 1762 I am rather amazed by what has been achieved through this forum.
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Post by annedw on Nov 3, 2011 23:11:06 GMT
The 1841 census for Wrexham area is missing, but a small part was found. Thnaks to Jill Rose , we now have these . These are all the Willco-cks in Wrexham Regis. 1841 Census Wrexham Town: Yorke Street: Jno. WILLCO-CK 77 Ind. born in County Dorothy WILLCO-CK 73 born in County Eliz. WILLIAMS 24 F.S. born in County Isle of Man: Edwd. WILLCO-CK 25 Joiner's J(ourneyman) born in County Sarah WILLCO-CK 25 born in County Wm WILLCO-CK 3 born in County Elizth WILLCO-CK 1 born in County Willow Hill: Ann WILLCO-CK 39 Charwoman born in County Thomas WILLCO-CK 14 born in County Richard WILLCO-CK 13 born in County John WILLCO-CK 11 born in County Elizabeth WILLCO-CK 9 born in County Mary WILLCO-CK 5 born in County William WILLCO-CK 2 born in County There are a couple of other marriages that Jill has added. freespace.virgin.net/jill.farndon25/W.html
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Post by annedw on Nov 4, 2011 12:19:09 GMT
I have looked at some of A N Palmers books, and there is very little mention of Plas Noble or Willco-ck at all. Jill Rose has offered to update her site with any details she has from the PR`s , and will let me know when it`s been added. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- I did find a Philip Wilc-ock mention in Denbighshire archives, and asked them what the document was about. This is the reply. It seems then that Wilco-cks were in Wrexham for quite a while. DD/WY/1232 is a Mortgage in £100, dated 9 October 1781, of a house and lands in Dynhynlle Isa, Ruabon, between (i) Thomas Pritchard of Ruabon yeoman and (ii) Philip Wilco-ck of Wrexham, flaxdresser, and Richard Davies of Wrexham, joiner, stewards of the United Society held at the Black Lion in Hope Street, Wrexham. -------------------------------------------------------------------- www.llgc.org.uk/php_ffeiliau/sf_s.php Also found this ;D John didn`t have much luck with his apprentices, Accused John Parry; Parish: Wrexham; Status: Apprentice flax-dresser, Offence Departing service without due cause. Prisoner serving his apprenticeship under the prosecutor. No indictment. Parish: Wrexham; Date: 1779 Prosecutor John Wilco-ck, Wrexham, flax-dresser Accused Thomas Prytherch the yo; Parish: Wrexham; Status: Apprentice flax-dresser Offence Departing service while serving an apprenticeship under the prosecutor. No indictment. Parish: Wrexham; Date: 1779 Prosecutor John Wilco-ck, Wrexham, flax-dresser
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Post by frankm on Nov 5, 2011 1:05:35 GMT
More great info this morning (evening) Thanks. Something I have found which I thought was interesting concerning this
Marriage Bonds Willco-ck, John, bach., flax draper, Wrexham, Denbighshire to Rogers, Ellinor, sp., Wrexham, : 1762 Oct. 23. John was a flax dresser and I have read that the draper part comes about by transcribers translating drefser as draper, the f being one of those funny s's Seems to be good reasoning on someones part.
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Post by eluned on Nov 5, 2011 10:05:42 GMT
The mis transcription sounds very plausible....I received a marriage certificate from a local register office some years ago for one of my lines "Ross." Unfortunately the registrar had mistranscribed it as Rofs and even when I queried it, they were adamant that they'd got it right
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Post by annedw on Nov 5, 2011 17:14:59 GMT
1861 18 Madeira Hill, Wrexham Abbot RG9; Piece: 4288; Folio: 52; Page: 13 Ann Will--ck H wid 58 Thomas son unm 34 plumber journeyman Phillip son 11 sch All born Wrexham 14 Feb 1864 . Marriage. A Thomas Willco-ck plumber ba of Wrexham aged 30 married Elizabeth Avery sp age 25 at Chester, St John, , his father was Thomas a carpenter , her father was James a needle manufacturer. Wittnesses were Sarah Avery and Geroge Thomas. Additional info B Windsor Terrace. Who that refers to I don`t know. So far I`ve not found the marriage of Thomas and Elizabeth, parents of Thomas b 1802. In fact I`ve not found many at all in Wrexham I`ll sort what I have so far and post them another day.
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Post by frankm on Nov 5, 2011 21:27:59 GMT
Not sure if Jill has updated her site but there is a lot of good information there for me. Need to go through but I found out what happened to " my late nephew Edward" mentioned in John's will.
12 Jun 1847 bur/o Edward age 37 (killed by a brick falling on his head in the New Market Hall)
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Post by annedw on Nov 6, 2011 11:13:05 GMT
Poor Edward, I worked in the Market Hall , I had a Saturday job on one of the stalls.
Jill Rose sent me this, from the `History of the Parish of Marchwiel:`
'In the 1950s and until his death in 1966, Simon Yorke IV (of Erddig) was occasionally in the village, usually on horseback inspecting his farms, whereas his younger brother Philip lived at Plas Noble and, later in Ruabon, before inheriting Erddig in due couse.'
This suggests that Plas Noble was sold to the Yorke`s of Erddig, perhaps after Williams death in 1878
These documents are held at Flintshire Records office,
MARCHWIEL Papers re sales of various properties including Strytyrhwch Farm, Sontly smithy and Plas Noble. 1809 - 1947 D/KY/1108-1111
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Post by frankm on Nov 7, 2011 3:25:55 GMT
Thanks annedw, From this it looks as if Plas Nobel was or became part of the Erddig estate. In John's will of 1849 it reads as though it was his to leave to his brother Thomas at that time. I am hoping if I find more of the history of Plas Noble I will also get further back in the family history. From the information on Jill's site I think there may be a brother Philip to the above John and Thomas father.
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Post by annedw on Nov 7, 2011 11:04:03 GMT
Jill has updated her site with lots of names. I`ve picked out the Wrexham and Marchwiel ones, and others that may be linked. Numbers are a Key to the Volume transcripts WILC-OCK 38 Wrexham: 24 Aug 1777 bap/o Mary (b 28 Jul) d/o Philip (flax dresser), Wrexham Regis 1 Jan 1785 bap/o Charlotte (b 18 Aug) d/o Philip, Wrexham Regis 10 Jun 1786 bap/o Philp (b 26) s/o Philp & Mary, Wrexham Regis
138 Wrexham: 18 Sep 1791 bap/o Mary (b 20 Feb) d/o Thomas (flaxdresser) & Elizabeth, Wrexham Regis 11 Apr 1795 bur/o Mary, Wrexham Regis 24 Apr 1796 bur/o Philip, Wrexham Regis 1 Jun 1800 bap/o Richard Jones s/o Thomas (flaxdresser) & Elizabeth, Wrexham Regis
304 Wrexham: 7 Feb 1733/34 bur/o John (yeoman) of Broughton 348 Wrexham: 31 Oct 1791 mar. by banns of John WILC-OCK & Dorothy OWENS, both otp Wits: Thomas WILLC-OCK, Eliza JONES,
364 Wrexham: 12 Jun 1847 bur/o Edward aged 37, Wrexham Abbot (killed by a brick falling on his head in the New Market Hall)
WILC-OCK 366 Wrexham: 29 Aug 1832 bap/o Elizabeth d/o Thomas (joiner) & Anne, Madeira Hill 12 Nov 1834 bap/o William s/o Thomas (joiner) & Ann, Madeira Hill
372 Wrexham: 25 Nov 1817 mar. by Banns of Richard ROBERTS (x) (farmer) ba. & Martha WILC-OCK (x) sp., both otp Wits: John DAVIES, Jane GITTINS (x)
373 Wrexham: 30 Jun 1824 bur/o Mary, aged 34, Brook Street 374 Wrexham: 13 Nov 1836 bap/o Mary d/o Thomas (joiner) & Ann, Madeira Hill 24 Aug 1838 bap/o William s/o Edward (joiner) & Sarah, Street Draw 27 Mar 1839 bap/o William s/o Thomas (joiner) & Anne, Madeira Hill 375 Wrexham: 16 Oct 1870 bap/o William s/o William (butcher) & Elizabeth, Brook Street 29 Jun 1877 bap/o Thomas Henry /o Philip (joiner) & Ann Eleanor, Stansty
380 Wrexham: 30 Jul 1906 bap/o Lilian Emily (b 7 Jun) d/o Arthur Philip (commercial traveller) & Lilian Stanley, Brayside, Beechley Road
384 Wrexham: 10 Nov 1865 bur/o Ellen, aged 28, Mount Pleasant 15 Jan 1866 bur/o Mary Elizabeth, infant, Cattle Market
393 Wrexham: 31 Mar 1875 bur/o Thomas, aged 25, Liverpool 17 May 1876 bur/o Peter, aged 17 Ruthin Road
WILC-OCKS 201 Wrexham: 28 Dec 1811 Thomas WILC-OCKS (x) & Elizabeth WILLIAMS (x) wits. at mar. by Banns of George PRINCE (x) ba. of Hawarden & Mary WILLIAMS (x) sp. (Stansty) otp
304 Wrexham: 20 Sep 1738 bap/o John (b 14) s/o John Is John the father the chandler ? Is this John the one who is later a flaxdresser.
2 Oct 1753 bur/o Philip s/o John (chandler), Wrexham Regis 373 Wrexham: 13 Jun 1820 bur/o William, aged 77, Queen Street
WILC-OCK / WILCOX WILCOX 38 Wrexham: 2 Oct 1788 bap/o Ellinor (b 21 May) d/o Philip & Mary, Wrexham Regis 304 Wrexham: 17 May 1745 bap/o Charles (b 11) s/o John (chandler), Wrexham Regis 5 Mar 1747 bap/o Phillip (b 23) s/o John (chandler), Wrexham Regis 1 Dec 1750 bur/o Chas. s/o John (chandler), Wrexham Regis 9 Dec 1750 bap/o Elinor (b 28) d/o John (chandler), Wrexham Regis 3 Feb 1754 bap/o Philip (b 19) s/o John (chandler), Wrexham Regis 4 Jul 1756 bur/o Richard s/o John (chandler), Wrexham Regis
4 Jul 1751 bur/o Robert (victr), Wrexham Abbot
341 Ruabon: 27 Apr 1874 mar. by Lic. of Richard WILCOX (innkeeper) w/55 of Wrexham s/o Richard WILCOX (farmer) & Mary ROGERS sp/49 of Rhos d/o Edward ROGERS (farmer)
364 Wrexham: 8 Nov 1849 bur/o Amelia, aged 58, Wrexham Abbot 366 Wrexham: 14 Oct 1827 bap/o Richd s/o Thos. (joiner) & Ann, Wrexham
WILLC-OCK 30 Wrexham: 28 Aug 1763 bap/o John (b 3) s/o John (flaxdresser), Wrexham Regis 28 May 1766 bap/o Thomas (b 10) s/o John (flaxdresser), Wrexham Regis 18 Sep 1769 bap/o Mary (b 20) d/o John (flaxdresser), Wrexham Regis 27 Dec 1771 bap/o Ellinor (b 11 Nov) d/o John (flaxdresser), Wrexham Regis 11 Mar 1774 bap/o William (b 23 Feb) s/o John (flaxdresser), Wrexham Regis
38 Wrexham: 7 Nov 1778 bap/o William PHILLIP (b 20) s/o Willc-ock (flax dresser), Wrexham Regis 31 Aug 1777 bap/o Mary (b 28) d/o Philip (flax dresser), Wrexham Regis 30 Jun 1780 bap/o Jane (b 29) d/o W.
138 Wrexham: 18 Jul 1789 bur/o Ellinor, Wrexham Regis 8 Jun 1794 bap/o John (b 4 Feb) s/o Thomas (flaxdresser) & Elizabeth, Wrexham Regis 29 Jun 1798 bur/o Frances, aged 84, Wrexham Regis
268 Wrexham: 26 Oct 1800 Thos. WILLC-OCK & Eliz WILLthingy wits at mar. by Lic. of Richd TOMLINSON wdr & Grace POWELL wid.
304 Wrexham: 25 Nov 1742 bap/o William (b 20) s/o John (chandler)
348 Wrexham: 13 Nov 1775 Jno WILLC-OCK & Thomas ROWLAND wits. at mar. by Banns of Edw'd DAVIES (x) (lab) & Sarah FOX (x) sp., both otp 18 May 1788 Jn'o WILLC-OCK & Wm. HARRIS wits. at mar. by Banns of Thomas JONES & Eliz. POWELL (x), both otp 31 Oct 1791 mar. by banns of John WILC-OCK & Dorothy OWENS, both otp Wits: Thomas WILLC-OCK, Eliza JONES
363 Wrexham: 28 Feb 1879 bap/o Leah d/o Philip (inn keeper) & Ann Elanor, Swan Inn 12 Mar 1879 bap/o Josephene Elizabeth d/o ---- & Elizabeth, Nelson St. 8 Oct 1880 bap/o Minnie Eleanor d/o Thomas (gentleman) & Elizabeth, 4 Caradoc Terrace 19 Jan 1882 bap/o George Philip s/o Philip (inn keeper) & Ann Eleanor, Pen y Bryn 7 Aug 1885 bap/o Maud Ann d/o Philip (inn keeper) & Ann Eleanor, New Swan Inn 24 Aug 1887 bap/o William Arthur s/o Philip (inn keeper) & Ann Eleanor, Swan Inn, Penybryn
364 Wrexham: 20 Nov 1843 bur/o Phillip, infant, Madena Hill 21 Nov 1843 bur/o Thomas, infant, Wrexham Abbot 1 Nov 1850 bur/o John, aged 88, Wrexham Regis
366 Wrexham: 31 Jul 1826 bap/o Thomas s/o Thomas (joiner) & Anne, Mount Street 18 Oct 1829 bap/o John s/o Thomas (joiner) & Anne, Maderia Hill
WIL-OCK/WILLC-OCK 370 Wrexham: 21 Jul 1864 bap/o John Albert s/o Thomas (plumber) & Elizabeth, Rhostyllen 24 Nov 1865 bap/o Mary Elizabeth d/o Thomas (plumber) & Elizabeth, Cattle Market 23 Feb 1868 bap/o Thomas Avery s/o Thomas (plumber) & Elizabeth, Beast Market
372 Wrexham: 1 Oct 1816 Martha WILLC-OCK & Evan THOMAS (x) wits. at mar. by Banns of William PRITCHARD (collier) & Mary LLOYD (x) sp., both otp
375 Wrexham 4 Aug 1869 bap/o Florence /o Thomas (plumber) & Elizabeth, Beast Market 23 Aug 1872 bap/o John William /o Thomas (inn keeper) & Elizabeth, Town Hill 18 Aug 1875 bap/o Arthur Phillip /o Thomas (inn keeper) & Elizabeth, 3 Tuns Inn 8 Oct 1875 bap/o Fanny /o William (butcher) & Elizabeth, Beast Market 11 May 1877 bap/o Bessie /o Thomas (inn keeper) & Elizabeth, 4 Caradoc Terrace
393 Wrexham: 17 Apr 1878 bur/o William, aged 39, Brook St. 24 Jan 1882 bur/o George Philip, infant, Swan Inn
400 Wrexham: 12 Jun 1827 mar. by Lic. (wcop) of Richard Jones WILLC-OCK ba. & Eliza LONSDALE sp., both otp Wits: Rob. THORNLEY, Susannah JONES, James LONSDALE
401 Wrexham: 18 Nov 1834 Margaret WILLC-OCK & Michael EDWARDS wits. at mar. (wcof) of Richard ROBERTS & Mary ROGERS (x), both otp 27 Jun 1837 mar. by Banns (wcof) of Edward WILLC-OCK wdr & Sarah ELLIS sp, both otp Wits. John ELLIS, Mary HUGHES (x)
363 Wrexham: 6 Jun 1886 bap/o Violet Ruth d/o Arthur (Serg't 23rd Reg.) & Emma, Barracks
WILLCOX 304 Wrexham: 5 Mar 1739/40 bur/o Sarah (spinster) 14 Nov 1740 bap/o Eliza (b 25 Oct) d/o John (chandler)
WILLIC-OCK 348 Wrexham: 18 Feb 1775 Philip WILLIC-OCK & Thomas SHEFTON wits. at mar. by Banns of John CLARKSEN (farrier) (sig. CLARKSON) & Margaret SHEFFTON (x) sp. both otp WILLC-OCKS 75 Marchwiel: 10 Jan 1802 bap/o Thomas s/o Thomas & Elizabeth 10 Jun 1804 bap/o Frances d/o Thomas & Elizabeth 29 Mar 1807 bap/o Elizabeth d/o Thomas & Elizabeth 29 Aug 1810 bap/o Edward s/o Thomas & Mary
266 Marchwiel: 8 Apr 1813 bap/o William s/o Thomas (farmer) & Elizabeth, Sontley
266 Marchwiel: 11 Apr 1814 bur/o Elizabeth, aged 43, Plas Noble
WILC-OCK/WILLC-OCK 266 Marchwiel: 7 Jan 1832 mar. by Lic. of Samuel STOCKER (x) ba. & Elizabeth WILLC-OCK (sig) sp., both otp Wits: Edward WILLC-OCK (sic – WILLC-OCK crossed through), sig. Ann ROBERTS sig. 17 Apr 1832 mar. by Banns of Edward WILLC-OCK sig. ba. of Marchwiel & Margaret ROGERS sig. sp. of Wrexham Wits: Edward ROGERS sig., & Mary ROGERS (x)
359 Rhosymedre: 24 Dec 1850 mar. by Banns of Abraham MORRIS (lab) (x) wdr. of Gyfelie s/o John MORRIS (brickmaker) & Elizabeth STOCKER wid. of Gyfelie d/o Thomas WILC-OCK (farmer)
392 Gresford: 11 Jan 1732/33 mar. by Lic. of Richard WILLC-OCK & Elinor THOMAS, both otp 12 Oct 1734 bap/o Richard s/o Richard 18 Sep 1735 bap/o Constans base d/o John
351 Wrexham Ruthin Road Cemetery MIs: No. 6: Ann WILLC-OCK, John Albert WILLC-OCK, Mary Elizabeth WILLC-OCK, Thomas Avery WILLC-OCK, Mary JONES No. 23: Thomas WILLC-OCK (s/o Peter & Rebecca WILLC-OCK) died 28 Mar 1875 aged 25 years Peter WILLC-OCK No. 55 Ann WILLC-OCK died 19 Feb 1865 aged 69 years John Albert WILLC-OCK (s/o Thomas & Elizabeth WILLC-OCK) died 1 Jun 1865 aged 10 months Mary Elizabeth WILLC-OCK died 10 Jan 1866 aged 3 months John WILLC-OCK died 9 Aug 1875 aged 36 years
Marchwiel MIs. St Marcella`s. (177) John Willco-ck Plas Noble died February 14 1875 aged 80.
(178) Elizabeth Willco-ck Plas Noble died April 14 1814 aged 43 Also Thomas Willco-ck Plas Noble died May 22 1850 aged 86 also Mary eldest daughter of the above died Dec 17 1864 aged 75
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Post by annedw on Nov 7, 2011 11:26:25 GMT
To go with the above I have found more wills and have picked out names and places. hdl.handle.net/10107/935639John Willc-ock . Wrexham. Gent 1718. Dated 5 June 1718. Wife – Margaret Willc-ock ( nee Parry , father Davis/d ) Sister – Elizabeth Phillips Sister - Canora ? Phillips Sister - Elenor Willc-ock Sister - Sarah Willc-ock Son John Willc-ock ( only son ) Lands and tenements in Wrexham in ?? occupations of Richard Clark labor , Davis Points ? , Catherine Morgan, Richard Hand farm? labor, John Parker Emmanuel Lewis, John Baron Plaistowe ?, John Griffith taylor ? Jane Jones spinster ? Richard Phillips bodysmaker ? Jane Nicholas spinster, Catherine Kendrick spinster, Catherine Shiphon ? spinster, John Hughes chimney sweeper, Hugh Jones horse courser?, …….. house near Tutle Bridge in Wrexham … Sarah Zachary … Tuttle Street … on the meadow lying between the Mount and Tutle Bridge … land in the holding of Davis/d Parry my fa& in law … after her decease she making no spoils waste or dest?? to my only son and heir John Willc-ock.. but if should he happen to depart this life before he attains the age of one and twenty years without issue. I do appoint and ordain my said wife to be sole executrix of this my last will and testament and my good friend Richard Benjamin and my fa in law Davis Parry guardians of my son Jo` Willc-ock . Signed by John Willco-ck , Thos Pownell, Roger Burton, John ?? Latin entry dated 20 Marty ? ( March / May) 1718/9 signed by Rob. Wynne. So John Willc-ock jnr was under 21 in 1718 , therefore must have been born after 1697, for him to have guardians seems to suggest he was quite young when his father died. hdl.handle.net/10107/90943John Wilc-ock Bersham will 1727. 30 August 1727 – 27 Oct 1727 Daughter - Mary wife of Richard Rogers of Bersham Daughter - Anne wife of William Evans of Broughton Son - Richard ( youngest ) Daughter – Eleanor Wil-thingy ( youngest) Wife – my said wife Martha Or other wife Dorothy , does this mean that she died and he them married Martha. Wittness Peter Long. " Rice ? Jones. hdl.handle.net/10107/993784This seems to be the widow of John Wilc-ock of Bersham Martha Willc-ock Wrexham, , Widow will, 1730 14 August 1729. Daughter - Mary wife of Richard Rogers Daughter – Anne wife of William Evans William – the son of William Evans was left a heifer calf. Son – John Willc-ock Son – Richard Willc-ock Daughter – Ellin Willc-ock Wittness Hugh Jones, William Thomas. also mark of Robert and Thomas.( who) 31 October 1731 Last page signed by John Williams, Samuel Thomas, John Willc-ock hdl.handle.net/10107/672791Wilcox, Ellenor, Wrexham, Ellenor Wilcox : bond, 1758 John Wilcox is named, as a nephew, next of kin, but he signs his name as John Willco-ck hdl.handle.net/10107/782885Sarah Wilc-ock - Bond. 1740 Signed by all three. Administration granted 5 May 1740 Ellin Wilc-ock spinster of Wrexham (sister) Christian Ottey widow of Wrexham Dorothy Puleston spinster of Wrexham hdl.handle.net/10107/263586John Wilc-ock yeoman Wrexham 1781 2 October 1780 proved 28 July 1781 Wife - Frances. Son - John Son - William Son – Phillip Houses in a street called the Green and in the occupation of John Griffiths, Sarah Jones, Phillip Wilc-ocks, Thomas Jones and that adjoining Thos Jones late in the occupation of Evan Evans. Signatures Edward Ducker, Charles Jones. Peter Williams
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Post by frankm on Nov 7, 2011 20:00:23 GMT
A lot to take in here, thanks. I have noticed this -
31 Jul 1826 bap/o Thomas s/o Thomas (joiner) & Anne, Mount Street Thomas and Ann - Married 09 Jul 1826 St John the Baptist Chester Assuming these are correct, would this be why they married in Chester rather than locally?
I had got Thomas b 1827 from census records and Richard anywhere from 1828 to 1831 where as 14 Oct 1827 bap/o Richd s/o Thos. (joiner) & Ann, Wrexham
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Post by annedw on Nov 7, 2011 22:35:51 GMT
It could well be , and also remember a child could be baptised anywhere well after it`s birth, so baptisms are not a true guide to age or place of birth. Chester is only 12 miles from Wrexham, so not too far to travel, perhaps Thomas was working there at the time. So far I`ve not found a marriage for Thomas and Elizabeth, c 1800
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Post by annedw on Nov 8, 2011 15:57:10 GMT
A little bit more which is quite interesting. I managed to get a look at the tithe map and plot records today. Dated 1842. Plas Noble is named , the occupier is Thomas Willco-ck and the land owner is John Willco-ck , most of the surrounding land was owned by Simon Yorke Esq or Sir Watkins Williams Wynne. Johns land covered plots 494 to 504, it amounted to over 26 acres, and the amount payable to the Rector of Marchwiel was £5.17s 3d.
Where you see Sontley in a PR entry it will problably mean they were at Plas Noble, because that is the area it is in.
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Post by frankm on Nov 8, 2011 16:53:16 GMT
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Post by annedw on Nov 8, 2011 22:34:29 GMT
www.flashearth.com/?lat=53.020096&lon=-2.992366&z=19&r=0&src=mslComparing the maps, I am almost 99.99% sure this is Plas Noble, I have walked from Wrexham down Sontley Road many times in the past, you used to able to go through the woods opposite Plas Noble to Erddig Hall before the NT took it over, I probably walked in the footsteps of the Wilcoc-k family
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Post by frankm on Nov 9, 2011 5:53:51 GMT
I'm sure your right. There is an old photo on a link you gave me earlier welshmormonhistory.org/index.php?/immigrants/view/898I did a search for Plas Noble Wrexham on Google maps and there are links to more modern photos there. The house appears to be bigger now but more or less in the same place. Some of the barns still look to be 'original'. Walking through history sounds great :-), I'm afraid I will not get the opportunity to do the same :-(
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Post by annedw on Nov 9, 2011 14:20:53 GMT
From this John Willc-ock . Wrexham. Gent 1718. will you can see where John has his properties, Tuttle bridge, Tuttle Street, the Mount, Reply 34, " Mr. Wilco-ck lived in his own house on the east side of York Street, next below " The Hop Pole " (now " The Black Horse "). Reply 32 John is on Yorke Street in 1841. I have found that Tuttle Bridge was over the River Gwenfro between Tuttle St and Madiera Hill where the family lived later. www.flashearth.com/?lat=53.04403&lon=-2.992504&z=17.1&r=348&src=mslI`ve linked the map to St Giles Church, and you can see Maderia Hill at the bottom, leading over the Gwenfro to Tuttle Street,( Stryt Twtil) then on to Mount Street and to the left up York Street. Just off York St on the RH side is a road , the building above it is the Black Horse, which is still open, so John was living close to there. www.wrecsam.gov.uk/assets/pdfs/museum/footprints/wrexhamap.pdfEluned posted this map before and you can see the area again, the only thing I wonder about, is that the Black Horse is on the West side of Yorke Street, but it was a long time ago , perhaps it was knocked down and another one built.
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Post by annedw on Nov 9, 2011 16:00:01 GMT
Who lived at Plas Noble.
Elizabeth Willco-ck Plas Noble died April 14 1814 aged 43 Also Thomas Willco-ck Plas Noble died May 22 1850 aged 86
1841 census is missing for much of Wrexham but we know from the Tithes that Thomas was there in 1842. Thomas died in 1850, and in 1851 his son William Willco-ck age 37 is living there with wife Elizabeth , mother in law, and niece Ann Arnold.
In 1861 William is still at Plas Noble, a farmer, Elizabeth is with him , but by now Ann Arnold has Willc-ock as her surname and is entered as his daughter.
1871 and William is now a butcher as well as a farmer, his wife is still alive. There is a visitor Richard Jones aged 38 he is a shirt manufacturer employing 57 people in Manchester. With them is Annie Jones niece aged 24, as she is born Ormskirk, I think we can safely say this is Ann Arnold / Willco-ck. There is a nine month old child, son of niece, named Arnold W Jones, born Marchwiel. Ann Arnold married Richard Jones in a civil marriage at Wrexham in Dec qtr 1869. William died in 1878 aged 65 at Plas Noble, he was buried 24th July in Wrexham Cemetery.
By 1881 the Willco-ock family have gone, and Edwards Evans, his wife Ann and son Robert William Evans are there.
Elizabeth died in September 1885 and is buried with William.
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Post by frankm on Nov 10, 2011 8:00:09 GMT
Thanks for all this, the possible link to John 1718 looks really good. Yes it looks as though the Black Horse moved across the street , what is more surprising to me is the large number that are still exactly where they were on the old map.
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Post by annedw on Nov 10, 2011 13:42:45 GMT
John in 1844. www.flashearth.com/?lat=53.046524&lon=-2.986872&z=16.3&r=342&src=mslJohn Wilcox land owner and occupier had a plot of land about where the cross is. Tithe was dated 1844, It was described as Beast market , croft, arable , just over 1 acre. Tithe of 7s6d payable to John Lloyd Salusbury Esq. The white roof is Tesco, and the triangular peice of land below at the junction of Market St and Charles St is the old Beast Market, now a car park. You can see most of it again on the Old Wrexham map,
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Post by frankm on Nov 11, 2011 5:26:48 GMT
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Post by lb on Nov 11, 2011 19:28:23 GMT
I do enjoy reading old wills. Here's a transcription of the bulk of John Wilthingy's will of 1718 which tells you exactly what he owned - quite a lot.
"Item I give and devise all the houses Lands and tenements now in my possession to my sd. wife...all those Houses with their & every of their appurtenances situate lying and being in Wrexham in the sd. County of Denbigh in a street there commonly called & known by the name of the Green in the Township of Wrexham Rs. [Regis] now or late in the severall tenures or occupations of Richard Clark laborer David Peirce webster [weaver] Catherine Morgan Richard Hand[...] laborer John Parker Bodyesmaker [Bodicemaker - used to be a big industry in Wrexham] Emmanuel Lewis thatcher John Bacon plaisterer John Griffith taylor Jane Jones spinster Richard Phillips Bodyesmaker Jane Nicholas spinster Catherine Kenrick spinster Catherine Stephen spinster John Hughes Chimney sweeper Hugh Jones Horse courser [horse-dealer] their Undertenants or assignes and also the Chief rent of eight Shillings [annually] due to me from two houses lyeing and being near Tutle [Tuttle] Bridge in Wrexham Rs. aforesaid now or Late in the tenure of Sarah Zachary or her undertenants and also the dye house in Tutle [Tuttle] Street in Wrexham Rs. [aforesaid] next to and adjoyning the houses in the tenure of the sd. Sarah Zachary and allso the house in the tenure of [Anne Peter? - nearly illegible] spinster lyeing and being in Tutle Street aforesaid in Wrexham Rs. aforesaid and yt. moyety or pte [moiety or part] of the Meadow lyeing Between the Mount & Tutle Bridge in Wrexham aforesd. [superscript "the moyety thereof"] being ab. one acre of Land now in the Holding of David Parry my Father in Law. to HOLD to her dureing her naturall life she makeing no Spoile waste or destruction thereupon and from and after her decease to my only son & heir John Wilthingy and to his heires and assignes for ever"
The witnesses include some of the wealthy businessmen of Wrexham. Thomas Pownell was a flaxdresser and Roger Burton a merchant and grocer.
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